NC State (NCAA photo)

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NC State’s CWS Removal: The Timeline Of Events

Analysis
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OMAHA — NC State is living a nightmare as Vanderbilt and Mississippi State prepare to play the CWS Championship Series beginning on Monday night.

The last 48 hours have been a tumultuous time for college baseball, to say the least. NC State’s incredible run came to end, and there’s little doubt the Pack would’ve had a strong chance to win the program’s first national title. However, as the college baseball world knows by now, their season ended after several players contracted COVID-19, and subsequent contact tracing declared their Saturday game against Vanderbilt a ‘no contest’. 

NC State’s removal from the College World Series has caused some serious vitriol toward the NCAA on social media and other avenues. And I get it. This is no way anyone’s season should have ended, and it’s by far the last way I want to see anyone’s season ended. I was thoroughly enjoying NC State’s CWS run. What an incredible, incredible run, and consummate ‘team’. 

In the early morning hours on Saturday, the D1Baseball staff hit the phones trying to figure out exactly what had happened on Friday leading up to the NCAA’s decision to declare Saturday’s Vandy-NC State game a ‘no contest’ at 1:10 a.m. Sources close to the NC State program spoke to myself and Aaron Fitt early Saturday. And today, we got to the bottom of everything with Anthony Holman, the Managing Director of Championships and Alliances for the NCAA. We corroborated much of the timeline with NC State sources on Sunday, though those same sources said this issue between NC State and the NCAA is far from over, and that the lack of communication was a serious problem.

For some context on COVID protocols and COVID-19 regarding other NCAA championships, Holman said this morning the NCAA has had 64 total championships (including baseball) with 284 total events, including the preliminary rounds of the championship tournaments, since the second week of February.

During that time, the NCAA has administered more than 130,000 tests with a positivity rate of 0.04% amongst more than 2,700 teams. Only two sports — men’s and women’s basketball — have had championships take place in a bubble where the NCAA has total control of who’s going in and who’s going out. The rest of those 62 championships, including baseball, fall under what are ‘controlled access’ championship events.

So, what exactly are the testing procedures for controlled access events?

It’s a two-step testing process. Every unvaccinated member of a team is required to take an antigen test upon arrival at a championship event, and the testing for unvaccinated individuals continues on a routine, scheduled basis. In Omaha, those have typically occurred a day before each team’s game.

So, the procedure is as follows: A player/coach/travel party member will take an antigen test, which has a higher false positive/negative rate than a more conclusive PCR test. If that person tests positive on an antigen test, the NCAA sends that person to take a more confirmatory PCR test. If that PCR test is positive as well, they are not cleared, and the individual then enters what the NCAA dubs ‘blue protocol’.

What does that mean? It means they are not clear to participate, and they immediately go into isolation, and thus contact tracing begins. All those guidelines, Holman said, are consistent with local health guidelines.

“It’s important to note that this approach has been working with other championship events,” Holman told D1Baseball. “When you look at the championships we have conducted, only two have been in a bubble, and for the most part, the championships have been successful in keeping COVID away. Our data continues to show that student athletes are not contracting this from competition.”

As our Aaron Fitt noted in this story from a couple of days ago, NC State joins an unfortunate list of programs who have had their seasons ended because of COVID issues — VCU Men’s Basketball, Michigan Men’s Ice Hockey, Notre Dame Men’s Ice Hockey and Rice Women’s Volleyball.

As for NC State, let’s get to the timeline of events over the past week.


Sunday, June 20

— The NCAA confirmed that testing the day before the Vanderbilt game revealed no positive COVID-19 test results among all members of the NC State traveling party. NC State was given the all clear to play Vanderbilt on Monday. 

Monday, June 21

— It was a great day for the Wolfpack. They defeated Vanderbilt 1-0 to move to 2-0 in the winner’s bracket. In the postgame press conference, NC State coach Elliott Avent pointed out a few members of the traveling party, including a player, had caught a ‘bug’ and were needing some rest the next few days. He pointed out that ‘other’ players were dealing with this bug, too. The NCAA said they found out later Monday that one of the players who had the ‘bug’ had a roommate removed at some point on Sunday, which created some concern inside the NCAA.

Tuesday, June 22

— The player that Avent said had a ‘bug’ on Monday, June 21, tested positive in an antigen and PCR test on Tuesday, which deemed him ‘not clear to participate’, and thus was directed to isolate. The roommate of the individual, who was in direct contact, was then directed to quarantine, according to the NCAA. The NCAA later found out that the first individual was symptomatic prior to Monday’s game, which Avent alluded to in his press conference. Avent did not know at the time it was COVID-19, however, just to make that perfectly clear. Avent, assistant coach Chris Hart and others also were tested, and were COVID-19 negative, NC State sources told D1Baseball. 

* Avent confirmed to D1Baseball that he was vaccinated in early March.

“We continued to test the close contact in hopes that they could come out of quarantine sooner, and perhaps they could actually play,” Holman said.

— Also on Tuesday, the NCAA sought out NC State to find out which members of the traveling party Avent was referring to when he said ‘some of our guys have a bug’. Those persons were identified, and when tested on June 22, were ‘negative’. “That was great news,” Holman said.

— Between Tuesday and Friday, June 25, NC State attempted to have the roommate of the first individual tested each day to potentially test out and be able to pitch. That request was not granted; though, the individual wound up testing positive later in the week anyway.

NC State captured the hearts of everyone in Omaha. (NCAA photo)

Friday, June 25

— Given the fact that NC State was scheduled to play Vanderbilt at 1 p.m. that day, it was not considered to be a testing day. However, the individual who was in close contact with the COVID positive player was tested in hopes that he would test negative and could come out of quarantine ‘sooner, and perhaps be able to play’. However, that player tested positive for COVID-19. He was then deemed out of action. That gave NC State two confirmed positive tests. 

— The same morning, NC State discovered two more players had shown symptoms consistent with COVID-19, so were proactive and sent them over to the Marriott for further testing. Those results arrived 90 minutes before the Vanderbilt game — both members of the traveling party were positive for COVID-19. That took NC State’s COVID-positive total to four. At that point, the NCAA took this matter up the chain to the Championship Medical Team to further evaluate the situation at hand, which is what created the 45-minute delay in the game’s start time. It’s worth noting the two players who tested positive that morning were unvaccinated players.

— At this point, the NCAA informed NC State that unvaccinated players would be removed from the game and only vaccinated players could play in the game. The NCAA gave NC State the option to either forfeit and try to play Saturday or play on with a limited roster. Avent and his team opted to play, though NC State sources say they proposed to the NCAA to play a doubleheader between the two teams on Saturday instead. That request was denied. At the start of the game, unvaccinated members of the Pack team were taken to the Marriott and tested. All of those unvaccinated members of the team were negative for COVID-19, including several prominent players on the roster. None of those players were able to return to the ballpark in time to enter the game.

– With NC State having four positive COVID-19 tests, the team reached ‘outbreak’ status, which then caused the NCAA to get all members of the team tested — including the vaccinated members who played in the Friday game against Vandy. We touched on how it was possible to test vaccinated players, here, a couple of days ago. NC State sources estimate that full team testing occurred around 7:30 p.m., Friday night, and that by 11 p.m., that evening, they still hadn’t gotten word on test results. There’s a lot of frustration from the NC State side of things on the lack of communication during that time frame. Shortly after that point, the results began to trickle in for each player — four players, all vaccinated — had tested positive for COVID-19, with all other players testing negative. Eight total members of NC State’s traveling party had tested positive for COVID-19.

Saturday, June 26

— According to NC State sources, it was around 1 a.m., that the NCAA informed the Wolfpack they were declared a ‘no contest’ for Saturday’s game against Vanderbilt and thus their season was over. It was then that all COVID-negative players decided to make the trek over to TD Ameritrade Park for one last picture behind home plate after a somber meeting with head coach Elliott Avent and his staff. With eight positive tests and impending contact tracing, the NCAA’s point of view was that it would be impossible for NC State to finish the tournament, while also caring about the health and safety of participants. Of course, that reasoning will be hotly contested by those who saw countless sendoff and welcoming parties at different team hotels around downtown Omaha over the past two weeks.

— All COVID-negative members of the NC State traveling party returned home to Raleigh and were greeted by thousands of fans at a welcome party at Doak Field. Those members will now have to quarantine for at least seven days, including Avent, who is scheduled to report to USA Baseball on Wednesday, June 30.

Sunday, June 27

— All COVID-positive members of the NC State traveling party returned home to Raleigh via a private flight from Omaha’s Eppley Airfield. 

No matter your stance on this issue, it was a dreadful way for NC State’s magical season to end.

But you now have the facts. Draw your own conclusions.

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LGWolf67
LGWolf67
2 months ago

Thanks Kendall. Sounds like the Pack tried to be proactive when discovering symptoms. The NCAA could’ve established a threshold in writing for no contest. Instead, the way Friday and Saturday went down looks like they made up rules as they went. 8 positives total if I read correctly. We could play with on Friday but not Saturday, even with confirmed PCR negatives.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  LGWolf67

The article said 8 members of the “traveling party” what does that mean? Does it include support staff? It sounds like it does becuase at times it referred to players and at other times it referred to traveling party.

Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

On close re-reading of the article, I count 8 positive players, but grant that it is confusing. In the same paragraph (the 2nd under Friday, June 25), the writer uses the words “players” and “traveling party” to refer to the same two people, the 3rd and 4th players to test positive. From the article:

“The same morning, NC State discovered two more players had shown symptoms consistent with COVID-19, so were proactive and sent them over to the Marriott for further testing. Those results arrived 90 minutes before the Vanderbilt game — both members of the traveling party were positive for COVID-19. That took NC State’s COVID-positive total to four.”

Tom Jordan
Tom Jordan
2 months ago
Reply to  LGWolf67

Correct observation in my opinion LG. Handled poorly by the NCAA. How unfortunate for NC St.

Peter DeLuca
Peter DeLuca
2 months ago

I would like to know the NCAA’s answer to this question: What would have happened if NC State beat Vandy Friday night, earning a spot in the finals? Would Mississippi State now be National Champions by default? Or… would the pending NC State/Mississippi State Championship Series be pushed back to allow the two rightful teams play for the crown?

Last edited 2 months ago by Peter DeLuca
Kevin Kisna
Kevin Kisna
2 months ago
Reply to  Peter DeLuca

Mississippi state would be champions. Kendall mentioned it in a tweet on Saturday morning

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Kevin Kisna

Kendall could not possibly know shit about what the NCAA would have done because the NCAA does not know themselves.

Michael Procton
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Certainly they do. Once you test out, you’re done and subsequent games are walkovers for your opponent.

Peter DeLuca
Peter DeLuca
2 months ago
Reply to  Kevin Kisna

I call bullshit.

If NC State would have won on Friday night, the NCAA wouldn’t have just cancelled the rest of the tournament and named Mississippi State Champions. I believe they would have made arrangements (pushing back the finals) to allow NC State to get their team healthy enough to make them money.

Which then leads to the question… if they would accommodate under those circumstances, why not accommodate the team before declaring a no contest?

Answer: The NCAA wanted Vandy playing in the finals.

Conclusion: NC State got screwed!

Last edited 2 months ago by Peter DeLuca
RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Peter DeLuca

I believe without a doubt if State had beaten Vanderbilt Friday they would have declared Vanderbilt the winner of Bracket 1.

Also, the reporting of AP news confirming the NCAA lied about the recommendation of the Douglas County Health Dept. to have State sent home should be a major red flag in the way this ALL went down.
If they were on the up and up, why lie about the health officials in Omaha being the ones responsible for sending State home.

There are also multiple sources reporting that Vanderbilt’s coaching staff asked for State’s vaccinated players to be tested.
I find this shady, underhanded and frankly, chickenshit.
They were petrified of our team, and wanted nothing to do with playing us, even in a diminished capacity.

This was a power grab. Plain and simple.

aceramey1
aceramey1
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

I’m team NC State here, but what are your sources that said Vandy coaches asked for NC State’s vaccinated players to be tested

oldhippievet
oldhippievet
2 months ago
Reply to  aceramey1

The Associated Press!

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  oldhippievet

The most dishonest people in the world are the media. If you believe an AP hit piece, you are a fool.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

Sentimental hogwash.. Without any foundation or proof

Scott
Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Peter DeLuca

NCAA wants money… who do you think draws more fans? Vandy or NC state?

Ohio Gazimus
Ohio Gazimus
2 months ago
Reply to  Peter DeLuca

This is not an issue because NC State would have lost the 3rd game. Magic over. Best team wins.

^Bad Take
^Bad Take
2 months ago
Reply to  Ohio Gazimus

Horrendous Take. Some would say God Awful.

RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Ohio Gazimus

That “team” scored one earned run against our raff in 18 innings.
Their lineup had 8 total hits in two games, and our pitcher had 3 hits in one game.
Best team wins, my ass. Vanderbilt knew as well as the rest of the nation that they couldn’t beat us at full strength even with their aces on the mound.
Once State got to their third starter and bullpen they have knocked their asses all over Omaha.

W. Steve Martin
W. Steve Martin
2 months ago
Reply to  Ohio Gazimus

Go home Troll.

Dallas Stevens III
Dallas Stevens III
2 months ago
Reply to  Ohio Gazimus

What third game? There were only ever going to be two.

oldhippievet
oldhippievet
2 months ago
Reply to  Ohio Gazimus

Like they lost so many other games before?

Ncaa fan
Ncaa fan
2 months ago
Reply to  Ohio Gazimus

You are stupid

jimbo11
jimbo11
2 months ago

The NCAA has no business disqualifying unvaccinated players. It was the vaccinated players who had Covid. Logic be damned when it comes to the NCAA and their insane Covid rules that are IN NO WAY based on science.

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  jimbo11

In the article it pretty clearly says that the first four positives came from unvaccinated players. That is the only reason the NCAA started testing the vaccinated players, finding the additional four positives.

COVID rules are definitely frustrating and there is a lot to potentially take issue with in this case. But the truth is that a fully vaccinated team would have been able to continue. Not sure that’s how it should have been but everyone knew the rules going in.

It was a risk to bring any unvaccinated people in a school’s travel party. Unfortunately, NC State paid a steep price. Again, I am not endorsing the protocols (particularly with 100% attendance) but everyone knew the deal. Some players made a personal choice that carried some risk for their program and it went the way it went.

Joe joe
Joe joe
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

My question is this then: if they’re worried about Covid cases, why are they not testing vaccinated players as well? 4 vaccinated players from NC State tested positive once they were tested. How many positive tests would there be if all the tournament’s vaccinated players were tested?

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  Joe joe

I would assume it’s because vaccinated players do not get symptoms, are not at risk for hospitalization or death and are at a much lower risk of transmitting the virus to someone else. Not a doctor but that is my understanding.

Essentially, a vaccinated person getting COVID is a non-event but an unvaccinated person getting it could be a much bigger issue, both for themselves and the people around them. There may have been more positives if the vaccinated player got tested but it would not have made a practical difference.

Ben
Ben
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

It’s almost like young people aren’t at risk… at all….

Joe Blow
Joe Blow
2 months ago
Reply to  Ben

they aren’t from the numbers.

Eric
Eric
2 months ago
Reply to  Ben
DStone
DStone
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

Vaccinated players and individuals can still get COVID symptoms, even severe ones requiring hospitalization or leading to death, but the chances do appear to be much lower. I had a fully vaccinated family member diagnosed with COVID 3 weeks after their second shot that required hospital treatment – and the doctor said he had seen a lot of similar patients. Research suggests that the vaccine may significantly reduce the symptoms in most people, but transmissibility doesn’t seem to change much. Long story short – the vaccinated players not being tested is a huge risk to everyone, especially unvaccinated players.

CMartin
CMartin
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

This is simply not true, a quick browse on social media or talking to many friends and family members who were vaxed and missed work from being sick says this is inaccurate and actually dangerous to our society to assume such.

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  CMartin

Oh, please. People on social media are quick to play up drama. You never hear from the boring, no trouble people.

Missing a day or two of work from a shot is not Purple Heart level trauma.

Troycyclist
Troycyclist
2 months ago
Reply to  CMartin

LOL

RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

If vaccinated players posed no risk, why not let them play Saturday?
Easy and most logical answer.
They were scared we’d beat them with 13 players. We almost did (and should have) Friday.
Paper champs. And I still have heard from multiple sources Vanderbilt asked for our vaccinated players to be tested.
Multiple sources

blackdiamond
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

you believe your team was unbeatable? Dang man, your team only beat vandy 1-0. You don’t know shit about baseball. Most of the country believed that your team would definitely lose to vandy the 2nd time and very possibly lose game 3.

Last edited 2 months ago by blackdiamond
BaconStripDivots
BaconStripDivots
2 months ago
Reply to  blackdiamond

And yet we’ll never know, blackdiamond.

Paul Long
Paul Long
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

Incorrect. An unvaccinated, 20 year old college athlete contracting COVID is also a non-event.

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  Paul Long

Speculating here but I doubt the NCAA was worried about the athletes themselves in this case since their risk of serious illness is very low. The concern would be the unvaccinated player’s ability to transmit the disease to others.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  Paul Long

It’s not quite a “non event” as, while age is a great indicator, they’re still only 4-5x less likely to get hospitalized than a 65-74 year old, which still makes COVID the most deadly threat to an unvaccinated 20 year old than any other cause of death. Yes, LIKELY to have a positive outcome, but there’s still 1-in-75 to 1-in-100 cases where a young person will suffer some time of significant long term result from the illness. I don’t agree with what the NCAA did, but I also don’t think the right position is to completely minimalized the concern either. Those players should have gotten vaccinated.

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  Chris

Check CDC VAERS from last Fri (& check again this Fri since it’s updated weekly). Per CDC as of March 397,335 deaths and injuries from covid vaccines have been reported. Again, they’re 3 months behind. This week CDC/FDA added warning to jabs for risk of myocarditis/pericardits. And group most affected (per CDC)? Males ages 18-29. And you say these young men should’ve gotten vaccinated. For what? You are aware that there is no Sars-Cov-V2 particles inside any of the current EUA vaxxes, right? Geez, do some research.

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  DoUrResearch

Downvoting statistics straight off CDC website? Laughable. You literally can’t handle the truth.

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

Big assumption. Have you seen CDC report from last Fri on VAERS? 397,335 deaths & injuries from covid vaccines reported so far & that’s from March since they’re 3 months behind (per CDC chart). And did you see CDC & FDA added statement abt risk of myocarditis & pericarditis this week? Know group affected the most? Males age 18-29. Facts can be so inconvenient.

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  DoUrResearch

Still downvoting? Statistics are from CDC. Look it up. Wait til tomorrow’s numbers come out. Maybe they’ll be into April reports by then.

Andy
Andy
2 months ago
Reply to  Joe joe

We’re the 4 vaccinated players tested just with the unreliable test or was it confirmed by the PCR test as well?

Kim
Kim
2 months ago
Reply to  Andy

the article states if there was a positive antigen test, they were then sent for a second PCR test.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  Andy

It should widely be expected that random testing would result in positive COVID rates for many vaccinated individuals. We can replicate the same thing with other things we vaccinate against.

Vaccines work by killing the virus once it enters your body before it has a chance to make you sick. With SARS-COV-2’s long incubation rate (2-14 days) compared to the flu (6 hours – 2 days), the virus can remain dormant in concentrations in the nose high enough to detect on a test but still be easily eradicated by the immune system.

If you randomly test the vaccinated population, you will get lots of positive tests, with no sickness.

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  Andy

And what was the CT on the PCR? Depending on the Cycling Threshold you can prove positive or negative, whichever one is the goal. Research Kary Mullis, inventor of PCR tests.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

Actually, the article only explicitly states that the second two players were unvaccinated players (the ones tested Friday morning). It says nothing about the original player (tested positive on Tuesday) nor the roommate of the original player that tested positive later in the week.

Whit
Whit
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

I guess I can’t read either because I was asking the same question as Brian – nowhere do I see where it says in this article that the first 2 players who tested positive were vaccinated or not. Please someone point it out if it is clearly stated in the article.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Whit

Precisely, Whit. If we take this a bit further, Aaron’s article from Saturday states …

“According to multiple sources, two unvaccinated NC State players tested positive for COVID-19 this week, prompting the NCAA to test the entire roster, including vaccinated players.”

At this point in time, four players had tested positive … but the above states that only two of them were unvaccinated. The two that were unvaccinated, as we know, were the ones that were tested Friday. But what of the original player that tested Tuesday? Are we to assume that he was vaccinated (along with the roommate) … else the above would have said “four unvaccinated players”.

JustAFan
JustAFan
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

Only NON vaccinated players had to have daily testing. Which means the first two who tested positive, were NON vaccinated

Whit
Whit
2 months ago
Reply to  JustAFan

They were tested because they had symptoms.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Whit

Precisely. The guidelines for testing are clear that “fully vaccinated student-athletes and other Tier 1 individuals with no COVID-19-like symptoms may be exempt from routine testing.”

#1 Notice the “may be exempt …”
#2 Fully-vaccinated student-athletes may only be exempt if they are not showing symptoms.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

Exactly

Whit
Whit
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

Brian – since you are one of the few reasonable people on these comments and since you seem to have the same question that I do – I personally think that this detail we are asking about is HUGE. If the player who tested positive on Tuesday was vaccinated – then CLEARLY he was tested because he had symptoms – not having anything to do with his vaccination status. If he was unvaccinated then it was still crazy to test vaccinated players – but at least there was a somewhat valid reason why they tested everyone. So many are so fast on these comments to blame the unvaccinated players and saying none of this would have happened if this original player was vaccinated – this totally debunks that theory if he was tested due to symptoms – not vaccination status. I’m simply interested in if he was tested due to symptoms or not and then his vaccination status may have more or less validity to the whole situation. I don’t have a dog in this fight – I am a UNC Alum – so for me it’s about being fair to 18-22 year olds who have dreamed most of their lives for this opportunity and if it was taken from them – then was it done fairly or not. If indeed he was vaccinated – then all those arguing that if the whole team was vaccinated they would not have had an issue are incorrect. I have spent an enormous amount of time studying and analyzing ALL information regarding Covid and the vaccines so I am knowledgeable from that perspective. I am sick of just getting smart ass answers and truly want to understand how the whole situation could have happened anyway. Properly fully vaccinated individuals should not have tested positive – at least not 4 of them or more. Brian please shed any light that you can. I am continuing to try to get this answer because I feel that question is so crucial. Thank you for being reasonable and polite.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Whit

I fully agree. Whether the original player was vaccinated or not, he was showing symptoms and was eligible for testing … and would be tested accordingly if the process was followed. And for all we know, that is why he was tested on Tuesday. This is the way it should be. And in fact, four vaccinated players did test positive. No information regarding whether they were showing symptoms or not.

But some information I learned today … all eight tested positive to the Delta variant. Either six of the eight were vaccinated … or four of the eight were vaccinated. In either case, I do not think there is anything they could have done. Yet you have some mainstream media blaming the unvaccinated players for this. I think that is wrong and not considering all of the information.

Rick R
Rick R
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

This article says that, but an interview I herd on Sirius XM’s college sports channel indicated the first two were unvaccinated, as I recall the interview.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Rick R

Please provide the link. Would be interested in hearing the interview. That said, the eight players tested positive to the Delta variant. At minimum (as has been reported), four of the eight players were vaccinated. But not against the Delta variant. Yet somehow this is the fault of the vaccinated players (not saying you said this … but some mainstream media came to that conclusion well before any real info was available)?

Andy
Andy
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

A teaching moment for ncaa. What a coincidence. Hogwash if you really believe in this many coincidences don’t get near me. Hogwash

CMartin
CMartin
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

From my count, 6 vaccinated and 2 unvaxed tested positive.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  CMartin

Not enough information to determine that. Two unknown, two unvax symtomatic and four vax asymptomatic.

Paul Long
Paul Long
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

That’s only because they were the first to be tested.

Dallas Stevens III
Dallas Stevens III
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

If as many vaccinated players as unvaccinated were positive it literally doesn’t matter if people were vaccinated or not. So get off your soapbox.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago

You’re grossly mistaking having a positive test for a viral load in the nasal cavity with having viral replication and sickness in the body. Vaccines only work when the virus actually enters the body and it has a chance to eradicate it before it does damage and spreads to others.

Being positive for SARS-COV-2 in the body and having/spreading COVID-19 are two different things.

Joe sloth
Joe sloth
2 months ago
Reply to  jimbo11

Can you read or are you just lazy?

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Joe sloth

Most likely both

BaseballFan
BaseballFan
2 months ago

So has the NCAA started testing the ALL players now, even the vaccinated for Vanderbilt and MSst? The precedent has been set that vaccinated players can test positive and, if positive, will not play so they should be testing them as well. There sounds like a lot of potential liability in not doing so.

Darell Cook
Darell Cook
2 months ago
Reply to  BaseballFan

The entire Vanderbilt team was tested Saturday and zero positive test results. Cannot speak to MS State.

Dom
Dom
2 months ago
Reply to  BaseballFan

All Vanderbilt players, even vaxxed, were tested and were negative.

Chris Utagawa
Chris Utagawa
2 months ago
Reply to  BaseballFan

The only reason the entire NC State team was tested (even vaccinated) was that they reached “outbreak” level with the first identified unvaccinated cases.

Kim
Kim
2 months ago
Reply to  BaseballFan

all remaining players were tested and cleared for tonight

Wally
Wally
2 months ago

No one seems to be able to explain the high positive test rate for the vaccinated players. At this high rate one must assume the test is wrong, the virus strain was resistant to the vaccination or the players were never vaccinated. If the Covid negative players and the vaccinated players were cleared to play then the game would not have had to be canceled….and the fact that Vandy was 100% vaccinated there would have be no risk of further infection outside of those already exposed who who were not yet positive….NCAA protocol does not appear to have changed since last year…science be damned.

CPrice
CPrice
2 months ago
Reply to  Wally

The question is what type of tests were administered? The rapid test can be inaccurate and the number of vaccinated players testing positive seems to be well outside the norm.

JustAFan
JustAFan
2 months ago
Reply to  CPrice

The antigen test is followed by a PCR. It’s not the 15 minute rapid test

RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  CPrice

WELL outside the norm. I’m not a statistician, or analyst, but it would be an astronomical number to 1.

Bill
2 months ago
Reply to  Wally

I agree with Wally . If all this is true and tests turn out to be accurate then our country has a bigger problem and this newCovid variant is jumping vaccines at a much higher rate now. 4 vaccinated players infected on one team? Odds on an MLB player hitting 150 HRs in a year seems to be better.I pray all these kids don’t get COVID related issues in their 50’s

Lance Laird
Lance Laird
2 months ago
Reply to  Wally

What it tells us is that this is a variant of the flu and the rest was totally political to get a certain administration out of office and a one world government into power!

Mort Blort
Mort Blort
2 months ago
Reply to  Lance Laird

Ummm … this is not the flu at all. The viruses aren’t similar. And eight months ago you were all claiming that Donald Trump invented the vaccine.

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  Wally

This proves covid is highly contagious and that it is more of a threat in a closed setting. All of which was already known. This is why protocols are still needed. Half a team playing with covid is a liability nightmare.

Patrick
Patrick
2 months ago

So when was the second test conducted that is part of the NCAA protocol? The 4 vaccinated players that tested positive were never tested a second time .

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago

“At this point, the NCAA informed NC State that unvaccinated players would be removed from the game and only vaccinated players could play in the game. The NCAA gave NC State the option to either forfeit and try to play Saturday or play on with a limited roster. Avent and his team opted to play, though NC State sources say they proposed to the NCAA to play a doubleheader between the two teams on Saturday instead.”

The NCAA told unvaccinated players they could not play and then took them to the Mariott and tested them only to find out that they were all negative. In the end, NCS had 8 members of their “travelling party”, not 8 players, that were Covid positive. This whole thing stinks. NCS was robbed. The NCAA HELD OUT THE UNVACINATED PLAYERS EVEN THOUGH THEY WERE NEGATIVE. This was a punitive act to punish NCS for having the temerity to respect the personal decision of some of their party to not get vaccinated. That should teach NCS to not mess with the NCAA NAZIS.

Last edited 2 months ago by B. Allen
P. Ditty
P. Ditty
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Did you read the article or do you just not know how? 4 unvaccinated players had already tested positive right before the game so it was reasonable to test all of the other ones. Additionally they weren’t “withheld” they just weren’t able to make it back to the stadium in time for the game. It absolutely sucks for NCS but when they made the decision to not get vaccinated, they were making the decision to face the potential consequences.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  P. Ditty

Yes I read every word, but I am not sure you did. It was 2 players and 2 members of the traveling party. You made my point. It was a punitive act to punish the unvaccinated instead. They held them out instead of delaying the game a day so they could be tested.

Last edited 2 months ago by B. Allen
Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Read it again..8 total

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  P. Ditty

Show me where it says that all four players that tested before the Friday game were unvaccinated. The article only explicitly states that the second two players were unvaccinated players (the ones tested Friday morning). It says nothing about the original player (tested positive on Tuesday) nor the roommate of the original player that tested positive later in the week.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

It says 8 total in the traveling party and is less clear about the vaxx vs unvaxxed

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

If you piece together what has been written this week, it is clear that four of the eight were vaccinated (from the last round of tests where all players were tested Friday evening) and that the two players tested Friday morning were unvaccinated. Now for the original two …

“According to multiple sources, two unvaccinated NC State players tested positive for COVID-19 this week, prompting the NCAA to test the entire roster, including vaccinated players.”

At this point in time, four players had tested positive … but the above states that only two of them were unvaccinated. The two that were unvaccinated, as we know, were the ones that were tested Friday. But what of the original player that tested Tuesday? Are we to assume that he was vaccinated (along with the roommate) … else the above would have said “four unvaccinated players”.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

The main point is NC State could have been proactive.. And this would have been avoided..

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

No, if the first two players are in fact vaccinated, NC State would still find themselves in the same position.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

Agree to disagree.. I think had NC State been fully vaxxed, they would have been allowed to finish the CWS.. Prove me wrong??

RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

7 of the 8 teams were not fully vaccinated.
This is NOT an “NC State was irresponsible” issue. If it were, then there were 6 more irresponsible baseball staffs and athletic departments that were irresponsible.

The day I see this happen to Alabama or Clemson football the day of the college football playoffs, Duke or the cheaters basketball programs the day of the final four, or Vanderbilt baseball then I’ll believe this was done without malice.

The NCAA deemed our program insignificant and treated us as such.
The long of it is this. NC STATE will be standing LONG after the dirt has been shoveled on the NCAA.
Perhaps then we’ll get an equal shake.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

Pretty sure you are wrong on just about everything you post here.. Sentimental drivel mostly

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

NC State in the finals would have been marketing GOLD for NCAA and NCAACWS and ESPN. There is no way they wanted this uproar instead of the underdog story.

It damn sure isn’t doing them any Vanderbilt favors.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

You can have a team that is fully vaxxed that could end up in the same situation. Vaxxed players will be tested if they are showing symptoms. If they have enough positive tests, they test the entire team (which they did).

If you are positive, you are positive. It does not matter whether you are vaxxed or not.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

Sure it does. Vaccinated people WILL test positive from time to time because that’s how vaccines work. It has to get into your body before your now-primed immune system can deal with it.

But if those players had been vaccinated, there’s more than a 95% chance they would have never shown symptoms/had any viral replication, never even taken a test, and would have continued to play.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  Chris

But what we are hearing is that all eight tested positive to the Delta variant. Either six of the eight were vaccinated … or four of the eight were vaccinated. In either case, I do not think there is anything they could have done. Yet you have some mainstream media blaming the unvaccinated players for this. I think that is wrong and not considering all of the information.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

That’s unlikely. If the first two players received the vaccine, their chances of showing symptomatic covid-19 would have dropped more than 20-fold.

JustAFan
JustAFan
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

Vaccinated players/members of the travel party were not tested until the outbreak (aka 4 positives). Therefore, the 4 positives were all UNVACCINATED players/members of the travel team.

Based on the fact that the first person that was sick had a roommate and his roommate (who was pulled from the room) would not be eligible to pitch, means that the first 4 positives were players.

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  JustAFan

Vaccinated players are tested if they are showing symptoms, which the original player was. As such, that original player showing symptoms was tested on Tuesday (positive). Meanwhile, the roommate was quarantined. NC State had requested that the roommate be tested (to clear him), but they were denied (he was not showing symptoms yet). If the roommate was unvaccinated, the requests for testing would not have been denied.

In addition to all of the above, if those first four were all unvaccinated, why not be clear and say it (if it is known) … instead of simply mentioning that two of them were unvaccinated (the ones that tested positive on Friday).

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  Brian

They requested the roommate be tested daily instead of every other day as the protocol laid out.

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  P. Ditty

Well P Ditty, seems you might not be able to read either. If you could read, then you’d know to check CDC VAERS site each Fri when they update. As of last Fri, there have been 397,335 deaths and injuries from covid VACCINES. It’s right there on CDC website. And bonus, they’re running 3 months behind so those numbers are only from March. If you dig deep enough on the chart, you can see exact data on each of the EUA vaxxes. Btw, just for fun, you also know these jabs aren’t actually vaccines, right? They don’t meet the legal definition. Read, P Ditty, read.

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  DoUrResearch

Ppl still downvoting CDC injury/death numbers from covid vaccines? Y’all are right. They’re horrible. And they’re only up to March.

Bill
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Unfortunately NCSU allowed unvaccinated people whether players or other traveling members to travel with them. Many teams did not. They rolled the dice and lost. It’s the contact tracing rules that get you everytime…not the number of infected.Articles before the Series started stated how vaccinated folks could be required to test as well.

RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

That’s inaccurate, or simply a lie.
7 of the 8 teams in Omaha had unvaccinated players.
And when you understand that, there were likely 40-50 with unvaccinated players in the tourney.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

Cite 1 verified source for this..and no Pack Pride is not a reputable source..

Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

Assuming this is accurate, then all of the unvaccinated players on the other teams were tested upon arrival and then every other day afterwards…and not a single person on another team tested positive.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Sutpens 100

Pretty sure he’s wrong.. Pulling numbers from his asshole

Daniel Stave
Daniel Stave
2 months ago

The moral of the story is: GET VACCINATED! If more than 13 members of the team had been vaccinated, they may have won Friday and made the Finals and bought themselves enough time for almost everyone to be able to play. I feel terrible for the vaccinated players, but the unvaccinated players should have been smarter.

azwildcatfan80
azwildcatfan80
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

That’s not the moral of the story, the moral is NCAA screws something up again. 20 year old athletes don’t need to be vaccinated unless they feel like it. No one needs to be vaccinated for this virus unless they feel like it. There’s an abundance of science showing this isn’t chickenpox or measles. The ones who are most at risk can be vaccinated. The ones not at risk can look at the unknown risks (no long term studies) and make their own decisions.

Jackson Hammer
Jackson Hammer
2 months ago
Reply to  azwildcatfan80

Either follow the governing bodys rules or dont. State rolled the dice fully aware of the potential consequences. Stop displacing the blame and be accountable….geez.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Jackson Hammer

Exactly

Pack1st
Pack1st
2 months ago
Reply to  Jackson Hammer

NCAA can stand to be accountable. Proven over and over again how incompetent they are.
Finding a way for these teams to compete is their job. NCAA screws up again. Common denominator……NCAA!!!!!!!!!!

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  azwildcatfan80

With respect, I don’t think anyone is taking issue with the players personal choice not to be vaccinated. I haven’t seen anyone advocating mandatory vaxes for all athletes unless I am missing something.

What some are pointing out (myself included) is that, while these players are free to choose what to do with their health, they don’t get to choose the consequences of their actions. In this case, the potential consequences were spelled out ahead of time. While it’s unfortunate and I may not agree with all the protocols, it’s hard to be truly sympathetic.

Smitty
Smitty
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

Most colleges now are requiring mandatory vaccination in the fall…..exemptions can be filed for medical or strongly held religious beliefs ….which the exemptions are reviewed by the trustees & admin (who are not required to be vaccinated, just strongly recommended) who determines that & how to one determine strongly religious beliefs….? This is all headed to a more divided country ….

Scott
Scott
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

The choice to be vaccinated should be about protecting yourself. If you feel you are at risk, you have the choice to be vaccinated. If you feel you are not at risk, you have the choice not to be vaccinated, period. We all take risks everyday and you took a much greater risk for loss of life in just traveling to the cws than that associated with covid. Quite placing responsibility and expectations for your personal health on others. Vaccinated players should have been allowed to play in any event. You either trust the vaccine, or you don’t.

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  Scott

I believe the thinking behind much of the protocols comes from a responsibility to protect others from a transmissible and deadly disease, not just oneself. If the NCAA thought the athletes were only responsible for their own health the protocols would likely be different.

Whit
Whit
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

If this was the “thinking” of the NCAA then there would not be 24,000 people in attendance with no masks and no proof of vaccination – so the theory of protecting anyone from transmissible disease goes out the window.

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  Whit

No argument there from me … the policy of full attendance but strict protocols for athletes is a mismatch for sure. My point was that these governing bodies do not view vaccination is strictly a personal choice because of its affect on others.

Donna
Donna
2 months ago
Reply to  azwildcatfan80

Well, tell that to the younger being hospitalized now with Covid. Thing is, if you are playing in a communal sport, you need vaccinations for more than just Covid. Science supports vaccination!

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  Donna

Science? As in, the CDC? As of last Friday there are 397,335 deaths & injuries from covid vaccines. Per CDC VAERS. They’re also running 3 months behind so those numbers are from March. Tell us about how the “science” forced CDC/FDA to put warnings for myocarditis & pericarditis on the vaxxes this week as the numbers of ppl developing after taking vax are thru the roof. CDC updates VAERS every Friday. Might want to check the “science” tomorrow to watch it go over 400,000 deaths and injuries.

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  azwildcatfan80

They can make a choice, but the choice has a consequence.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  azwildcatfan80

Would love to see the abundance of science citations you referred too…lol.

B Taylor
B Taylor
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

The moral of the story is the NCAA continues to make rules that make no sense. If Vandy was 100% vaccinated then what is the problem playing? If that is the standard and what you are saying is true…that they should all get vaccinated and this wouldn’t have happened…then if Vandy is vaccinated and NC State had enough players who have either tested negative or been vaccinated then the game should have been played…end of discussion!!

HJ Bear
HJ Bear
2 months ago
Reply to  B Taylor

Follow the money. If the NCAA was so concerned you would not have a stadium full of people.

Greg Davis
Greg Davis
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

So if all of our kids were vaccinated then we could have played the game with 4 covid positive players?

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  Greg Davis

Definitely.

JustAFan
JustAFan
2 months ago
Reply to  Greg Davis

If all the kids were fully vaccinated, there would have been no testing. Your vaccinated kids were only tested due to the 4 positive tests

Brian
Brian
2 months ago
Reply to  JustAFan

Not if they are showing symptoms, which the original player was. As such, that original player showing symptoms was tested on Tuesday (positive). Meanwhile, the roommate was quarantined. NC State had requested that the roommate be tested (to clear him), but they were denied (he was not showing symptoms yet). If the roommate was unvaccinated, the requests for testing would not have been denied.

In addition to all of the above, if those first four were all unvaccinated, why not be clear and say it … instead of simply mentioning that two of them were unvaccinated (the ones that tested positive on Friday).

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

Exactly correct.. Pretty simple

Andy
Andy
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

Just for fun,are you still wearing 2 mask?

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Andy

Best comment of the day and I think you know the answer to your question.

Mayeshays
Mayeshays
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

I agree. Its unfortunate being an NC State fan and the NCAA should have communicated better but I also believe that the entire traveling party(not just the rostered players) should have been vaccinated to not put the team in any type of bad situation like what occurred. Its a super disappointment. I may have missed read but did the NCAA confirm that there were not enough rostered players to put 9 on the field?

Tom DiGregorio
Tom DiGregorio
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

I could not agree more. They had a choice to get the vaccine or not. That is their right and I support that 100%. However decisions have consequences. If NC State wants to blame anyone they need to first look in the mirror.

Tom Miralia
Tom Miralia
2 months ago
Reply to  Tom DiGregorio

While its a bit of a rationalization, please keep in mind the timeline for these teams and in particular NC State’s- As the article indicates the vaccine was made available at the end of the first week in April. That was about the time NCS started ‘heating up’ following a pretty disasterous start.

I figure in their ‘choicemaking mode’, many players might be reluctant to risk dealing with the side effects of the vaccines. Yes they are fairly mild, they are also common, and sometimes not so mild at all. Right? A risk is myocarditus maybe. Infection by the Virus can also carry a risk for that even in mild cases. The NCAA is pretty flipped out about that based on my observations. You get sat for 12 weeks if that happens. I mean shut down! Not nice. Further, probably a number of the guys had already had the Virus and the antibodies to defend them. Think about it.

At any rate, by the time the Regionals hit, from a practical standpoint, it is a challenge to get in the vax and deal with the effects perhaps. Nobody wants to mess with a ‘hot’ team?

They did encounter the Virus in pretty large numbers there were 8 players for sure testing positive. 4 vaxed and 4 not. Unfortunately, and while I disagree with the protocols and decision, my belief being that they were outdated and overly proscriptive, that squad had a serious outbreak issue. The consequences I struggle to agree with, but the fact remains there were going to be consequences.

All that said, on the whole, I encourage all to get vaccinated and deal with that as a better alternative to going unvaxed. And more so now having witnessed the heavy hand of a risk-adverse bureaucracy!

DoUrResearch
DoUrResearch
2 months ago
Reply to  Daniel Stave

Get vaccinated? Have you seen CDC website? VAERS? As of last Friday there were 397,335 deaths & injuries from covid vaccines PER CDC site. And they are 3 months behind on entering info so those numbers are from March. This week CDC/FDA had to add warning for myocarditis/pericarditis as so many young men ages 18-29 are being diagnosed with these deadly conditions after being vaxxed. Get informed, Daniel. New numbers release every Friday from CDC. Maybe we’ll get lucky and they’ll be up to April by tomorrow. Def will top 400,000 deaths & injuries.

Brad brown
Brad brown
2 months ago

Two questions I would like answered are why the earlier extra tests and the doubleheader were both denied by NCAA. Lots of teams play doubleheaders during CWS, especially when there is elimination on the line. it seems that Covid-19 protocols are only considered a factor for stopping games, not protecting what a team or teams have spent all season working for. By the way, I do not have a dog in this fight. I’m an OSU Beavers fan.

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  Brad brown

A doubleheader would disrupt the other game and would penalize Vanderbilt for NC State’s problem.

Richard
Richard
2 months ago
Reply to  Obmik

So would rain, or lightning in the area…And Vandy is NOT penalized, but rather benefits from the decision, mightily it turns out. Vandy still would have been favored in the DH because State was down players. Vandy is benefiting well from either or ANY scenario, no matter how this is spun. it is all what if’s now, but the denial of the DH owns a level of scrutiny hard to dismiss.

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  Richard

Rain and lightning are unknowns in any game. That’s baseball.

A doubleheader on Saturday has to be scheduled as a triple header. So, you want to start play at 7 central? How is that fair in any way to Vanderbilt?

And besides that, the doubleheader would have still been uncertain due to the situation. Vanderbilt should not have to keep waiting around until NC State can maybe find enough players.

The double header decision deserves no scrutiny. It would have made a bad situation much worse.

Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  Obmik

Does anyone remember a double header in the CWS? I don’t.

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  Richard

“Vandy is NOT penalized.” Really? For what? More emotional BS.

Shawn Tucker
Shawn Tucker
2 months ago
Reply to  Brad brown

Damn good question! NCAA won’t answer jack. Just come out and explain what this article just did.

Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  Shawn Tucker

They did. They explained it to Kendall and Aaron.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Sutpens 100

No they didn’t. The NCS folks told the D1 guys what happened.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

“Sources close to the NC State program spoke to myself and Aaron Fitt early Saturday. And today, we got to the bottom of everything with Anthony Holman, the Managing Director or Championships and Alliances for the NCAA. We corroborated much of the timeline with NC State sources on Sunday, though those same sources said this issue between NC State and the NCAA is far from over, and that the lack of communication was a serious problem.”

Last edited 2 months ago by B. Allen
RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Read your own post. Anthony Holman is NCAA not NCS

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  RICHARD

Yes I know. That is why I put it in quotes. Perhaps the D1 guys could clarify but I cannot. It sounds to me the the NCS people were spilling their guts to D1 and they asked the NCAA to confirm what NCS was saying and they did.

Last edited 2 months ago by B. Allen
Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Well, it may sound like that to you, but that is not at all what the article says.

What the article says is, “And today, we got to the bottom of everything with Anthony Holman, the Managing Director of Championships and Alliances for the NCAA. We corroborated much of the timeline with NC State sources…”

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Sutpens 100

Look, your team is in the finals. No one is blaming the two teams in the finals, well maybe a conspiracy guy or two. Enjoy the finals but this championship is unfortunately going to be blemished and that is on the NCAA. Long after most people have forgotten the winner of the 2021 CWS everyone will remember that NC State got screwed.

Last edited 2 months ago by B. Allen
Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Vanderbilt is not my team, although it might appear that I’m a Vandy fan since I’m being objective. I’m an Ole Miss fan who liked the hell out of the Wolfpack and might well have been cheering for them in the finals if they’d gotten that far. I might even have been cheering for them on Saturday had they been allowed to play, and I was looking forward to watching Sam Highfill both pitch and bat for himself Saturday.

I’m very sorry for what happened to NC State, but they definitely did not get screwed. Their coach and some of their players gambled and lost, when they could have completely avoided the risk of getting sent home. This wound was self-inflicted.

Last edited 2 months ago by Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  Sutpens 100

Given the fact that NC State is a public university, it’s not clear to me that the coach could have “demanded or mandated” all players get vaccinated, but he could have *strongly encouraged* them to; he could have explained the possible consequences to the team if they did not get vaccinated, he could have campaigned all season for team-wide vaccination. Maybe he could have arranged to get vaccinated in the locker room in March as a role model for his players. Instead, he abdicated his leadership role on this issue.

Last edited 2 months ago by Sutpens 100
Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Sutpens 100

Exactly correct.. This was an unforced error by NC State and not the NCAA..

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Sutpens 100

Betcha they wish now that they would have gotten the vaccine..

RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  RICHARD

Did Anthony Holman happen to mention why the NCAA lied about Douglas County’s Health Dept. Recommending State be sent home?????
I guessing he didn’t. And I’d bet my life he, and they, won’t.

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

And you know this how?

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  Brad brown

Please cite some examples of CWS doubleheaders. Im not saying they haven’t happened, I just don’t remember any.

azwildcatfan80
azwildcatfan80
2 months ago

What’s the point of vaccinations, and the strong push for everyone to get vaccinated, if you can’t continue on with life after a “positive test”?
Also, what’s the PCR cycle count? Scientists who are familiar with PCR tests claim that anything over a 30 cycle count (essentially magnification) can produce remnants of a virus and not an active infection.
Ludicrous

Donna
Donna
2 months ago
Reply to  azwildcatfan80

If everyone vaccinated it wouldn’t be a problem, but because there is a choice some are not vaccinated on other teams or staff or fans. That would spread to those who may suffer severe symptoms if contracted. So, if you are able GET VACCINATED!

Will R
Will R
2 months ago
Reply to  Donna

Baloney Donna. This is just more top down control.Yes the rules are in place by the NCAA [which are suspect at best]. As someone mentioned above, the PCR test if over 30 cycles will kick off false positives and is in no way a good measuring stick. The “championship medical team” needs to disclose this important information just to be completely transparent.

If everyone would take a step back and grab some common sense we’ll get back to living life freely again. Vaccination is not the be all end all. “Healthy” is the criterion not vaccination status. If you’re healthy you should be able to participate freely in society period end of story. If you’re sick you should stay in your room away from people until you recover. Simple as that. People who “may suffer severe symptoms” should be the ones to take heed to their health not the other way around. Otherwise this ridiculous new standard will never go away. Common sense.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Will R

You are a delusional simpleton

Will R
Will R
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

Ad hominem as expected, yawn Jon

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Will R

Truth hurts huh??..

Will R
Will R
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

If you have a refutation to what I’ve said then bring it Jon.

Rob
Rob
2 months ago
Reply to  Will R

I like to take my weapon outside, close my eyes, spin around, and fire shots at random. I understand that there is some risk to this activity and I could choose to just not do it because it is against the rules and, well, I might actually hurt somebody, but I must express my freedom as an American and publicly declare my political affiliation.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Rob

Well put.. Vaccination\science should not be a political football.. When 99% of the scientists agree on something; it’s a good idea to shut up and listen..

David
David
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

99% of the scientists agree that 21 yos are at risk from Covid, let alone at risk playing an outdoor sport?

Didn’t you just call someone a simpleton?

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  David

Are you really this thick..??..it’s about community spread and mutations.. Duh..

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

I won’t attempt to explain to you the concept of legal jurisdiction.. It would be way over your head.. Duh

Will R
Will R
2 months ago
Reply to  Rob

Nice refutation Rob, not….cuz you can’t. Try a little harder

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  Will R

Forgive me if I missed it. This a lengthy thread. What is your medical speciality?

Will R
Will R
2 months ago
Reply to  Obmik

You do realize what you’re asking is a form of an ‘Appeal to Accomplishment’ fallacy. Occurs when arguments are evaluated on the accomplishments, or success, of the person making the argument rather than on the merits of the argument itself.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Obmik

He’s an auto mechanic that likes to think he’s a doctor.. Great question..!! Lol

Mojo26
Mojo26
2 months ago
Reply to  Will R

I think the NCAA and other organizations are worried about people who are not showing symptoms transmitting the disease.

Will R
Will R
2 months ago
Reply to  Mojo26

I can appreciate that concern especially early on in the pandemic when we didn’t quite know what we do now. Plus we have natural immunity and vaccine immunity both contributing to herd immunity. I’m concerned that [and I hope I’m wrong] that this NCAA covid protocol will be how things are done ad infinitum when it should be ended like next year. That’s why the appeal to common sense.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Donna

Exactly correct.. The anti vaccine morons are strong on this thread.. Unfortunately..

LGWolf67
LGWolf67
2 months ago

1. There was never a set threshold for the no contest decision. They just decided. Completely inconsistent from the Friday decision.
2. The rationale for testing pulling all unvaccinated players who’d been tested throughout the week and tested the day before is boneheaded. It’s like calling a foul ball foul if you’re unsure.

They made it up as they went along.

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  LGWolf67

Infections do not translate into a positive test for several days. That is why all the NCS tests done Sunday were negative. Two conversions to positive over the next 2 days confirmed that the infection was very recent It is also why 4 confirmed positives doomed the other unvaccinated. A negative test Thursday or Friday could have converted to a positive by Friday or Saturday.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  RICHARD

I do believe testing unvaccinated players prior to a game and allowing them to play would be reasonable, but continue to place them in some sort of quarantine/monitoring during a concerned period. If an unvaccinated player tests negative for the virus hours before a game, they’re so unlikely to develop enough viral load in 6-10 hours to be contagious that the risk is minimal. The NCAA’s protocols and judgment calls deserve criticisms, but so does NC State not putting enough emphasis on the vaccine to keep the players healthy and prevent this whole mess from happening in the first place.

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  Chris

You are one of a few voices of reason and knowledge on this hysterical blog. I agree with everything you have pointed out.
Medically speaking, I see no reason they could not have cleared enough players for the game, but then I don’t have all the info, just what is released. The problem is that there is much misinformation and just plain ignorance in the public, the NCAA took the easy way out.

Justin S.
2 months ago

It strikes me that the members of a truly “consummate ‘team'” would do whatever they could to eliminate/minimize their risk of being sidelined due to COVID and costing themselves and their teammates a championship opportunity.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Justin S.

Stop, please just stop already. This is the NCAA’s F up. Most are sick hearing this blamed on 20 year old college kids. The NCAA stepped on their crank and this will be remembered long after this CWS.

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

So what would YOU have done? Disregarded the test results? Never done the tests to begin with? When you answer, please state your medical background, especially in immunology, if any. Also if you have a law degree, because this is a medico-legal issue. If the NCAA didn’t establish a strict protocol and HOLD TO IT, then they would have been in extreme legal jeopardy had there been an outbreak. Waiting for a reply.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  RICHARD

I said yesterday what I would have done. I would have not made NCS play the game short on Friday. I would have had all four teams that remained stand down. Tested everyone and given time to let cooler heads prevail. I would not have made the decision at 1am to kick a team out of the tournament. No, I am not a doctor, but yes I am a lawyer. However, I do not think there is a judiciable legal issue. Why do you want to defend the NCAA? I do not know who you are a fan of but if it is Vandy this is not about them. Vandy did nothing wrong. They can only play the teams in front of them. This is all on the NCAA.

Last edited 2 months ago by B. Allen
Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Then the lawyer in you ought to recognize the huge problem the NCAA would have faced in changing the rules, or deciding not to enforce the rules, in the middle of the tournament, as you suggest it should have done.

Last edited 2 months ago by Sutpens 100
Mark
Mark
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

It has been heavily “rumored” that Vandy coach Corbin threatened that he did not want his players on the field with unvaccinated players on a team with confirmed “positve” players.

RICHARD
RICHARD
2 months ago
Reply to  Mark

You people have no shame.

Donna
Donna
2 months ago
Reply to  RICHARD

Agree.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

The NCAA did F-up, but it was within NC State’s power to preempt the whole problem and they didn’t. Even if they didn’t pressure players to get vaccinated, they could have done more to keep them isolated during this critical time. NC State put a terrible organization (NCAA) in a position to do something terrible and they didn’t disappoint. They had it in their power to preclude it all.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Justin S.

Exactly correct.. It’s a easy solution.. Anti vaxx idiots on this site notwithstanding

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

I am not an anti vaxxer. In fact I was a volunteer Guinea pig for a vaccine test. However; I believe in personal freedom and while my whole family got vaxxed early, I have close friends who decided to not get vaxxed. It is still a free country and your arrogant statist attitude is really insulting. The fact that you have repeatedly resorted to calling those who do not think like you an idiot demonstrates the intellectual deficiency of your arguement.

Jackson Hammer
Jackson Hammer
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

But what you are speaking of has nothing to do with the current ncaa rules/protocols(which i think are absolutely insane and bs btw). Either follow the rules, or be accountable when you suffer the consequences of not following them. NCSU made a conscience effort to NOT follow them and has NOBODY to blame but themselves. NOBODY else is to blame……NOBODY.

Last edited 2 months ago by Jackson Hammer
B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Jackson Hammer

What rules did NCS break? There was no rule mandating vacination.

Jackson Hammer
Jackson Hammer
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Stop deflecting the blame……never said there was a ‘rule’ mandating vaccines or that State broke any rules. They did conscientiously put themselves in a position to get kicked out of the CWS. Could have easily been avoided, but for whatever reason(s) State took the chance and got popped. Nobody to blame but themselves for giving the NCAA even the slightest upper-hand in being able to remove them. Just pure stupidity given the current Covid world…..plain and simple.

Donna
Donna
2 months ago
Reply to  Jackson Hammer

According to the article, it was the coach for NCS who alerted the NCAA to be concerned by sharing “cold symptoms” with one of his players during an interview.

Clay
Clay
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

Very well said, I feel like unvaccinated players forced to sit out while not testing positive is fundamentally wrong in a free country. Huge overreach by ncaa.

dawg
dawg
2 months ago
Reply to  Clay

Your post strongly suggests that you’re unaware people can be contagious before they test positive.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  B. Allen

There is no intellectual deficiency in my argument..99% of scientists agree with me..

BPDowdD1
BPDowdD1
2 months ago

C Berry – your comment sounds great but your facts about the Advisory Board are false. There are 16 members, none of whom are affiliated with Vanderbilt.
https://www.ncaa.org/sport-science-institute/covid-19-medical-advisory-group

Sutpens 100
Sutpens 100
2 months ago
Reply to  BPDowdD1

Nice. Thank you.

B Taylor
B Taylor
2 months ago

Let the kids who are more likely to die driving to and from the park than from Covid play a game outside, that requires little or no close contact and with negative tested and vaccinated players instead of yet again messing things up for the student athletes you proclaim to be watching out for! I have defended the NCAA for the last time. I have tried but have no leg to stand on here or ever again!

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  B Taylor

Welcome to reality. As I posted yesterday “I HATE THE NCAA.” AFTER READING THIS ARTICLE I HATE THEM EVEN MORE.

Thomas Powell
2 months ago

Give us a break CBerry … you think you have a conspiracy theory … huh? Vanderbilt baseball doesn’t need an immunology professor to give them a CWS spot… Too bad for all that it couldn’t be decided on the field, but it seems to me that if NCS had been more proactive with vaccinations, this would never have happened. And I’m sorry … I liked your team and its chances, especially after beating Leiter 1-0.

Cdphipps
Cdphipps
2 months ago
Reply to  Thomas Powell

Like tbe guy doesn’t still have friends on the board!

Lee
Lee
2 months ago
Reply to  Cdphipps

No need for that kind of comment.

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  Cdphipps

How many scientists do you know at that level? I know a few, and at that level they are not going to risk their reputation on a baseball game, let alone do it for a friend.

Frank Biederer
Frank Biederer
2 months ago
Reply to  Thomas Powell

right cause they already have those extra scholarships. thanks for pointing that out.

RB Allen
RB Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Thomas Powell

No, what Vanderbilt needed was to not play a team that was head and shoulders better than them.
And the NCAA solved that problem for them after we shut their vaunted offense down twice

Obmik
Obmik
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

They needed help to kick out the team that barely beat them earlier in the week? Good grief. Keep the conspiracy theories grounded in reality.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  RB Allen

Conspiracy theory nonsense.. NC State f-ed up..deal with it.. Cry baby

kivett michael
kivett michael
2 months ago

I say this was a set up. I trust all the players are retesting at a reliable medical facility in Raleigh.

Jen T
Jen T
2 months ago

Vandy was exposed as well. The game should have played on. This team took them on with two original position players. Imagine what would have happened if the original 8 who were forced to sit after negative results posted had been allowed to play.

Chris
Chris
2 months ago
Reply to  Jen T

I’ve thought about this and while I agree, typically the CDC considers someone exposed if they’ve been in close contact with someone for more than 15 minutes. It’s unlikely any of the player exchanges during game 1 would have met this requirement, especially outdoors. This is a near 100% indoor-close-contact spread virus, so there’s not much medical basis to consider Vandy under threat.

Which is why I think the move to test the vaccinated players was unscientific and something the NC State team should be most upset about.

Julia Engelmann
Julia Engelmann
2 months ago

Thanks…very thorough and sounds like NCAA followed protocols afterall. Sadly in hindsight…it seems like if teams had been vaccinated there would have been no testing..therefore they would have played…alas it does show that even those of us vaccinated can still have the virus – tomatoe-tomato. Still sad way to go out.

Shawn Tucker
Shawn Tucker
2 months ago

NCAA gave them the choice to forfeit or play Sat. State asked to play a DH on Sat (to give them time to get their guys tested – which it says we’re all negative) and NCAA denied.
They didn’t care about these student athletes or the health and safety of them. They made it up as the went along as there was never a “set threshold” laid out for the number of positives that would get you sent home. It’s already been reported that the local health dept didn’t corroborate with the NCAA as the NCAA says. The health dept said they’d go along with whatever was decided but the NCAA made it sound like in their release that decision was made in conjunction with the health dept.

And you are correct – if all were vaxxed then there would’ve been no testing. But we had vaxxed guys hit positive. Oh the irony….Another point to prove that the NCAA doesn’t really care about the health and safety of the student athletes. They just keep cashing in on the $$.

B. Allen
B. Allen
2 months ago
Reply to  Shawn Tucker

Well stated!

JustAFan
JustAFan
2 months ago
Reply to  Shawn Tucker

Your vaccinated players were ONLY TESTED because you had FOUR UNVACCINATED players test POSITIVE.

If your whole team was vaccinated, it wouldn’t have matter if everyone had covid, because not one of them would have been tested.

Lee
Lee
2 months ago
Reply to  JustAFan

I don’t believe that’s accurate. If the players, even though having been vaccinated, displayed symptoms they would’ve been tested.

Chad
Chad
2 months ago
Reply to  JustAFan

That makes makes perfect sense….

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Dana Lyn

A biased article from Pack Pride.. Shocking that it would be slanted..

LGWolf67
LGWolf67
2 months ago

The issue isn’t that some may have been disqualified from participating as far as I’m concerned. It’s that the NCAA DQd a team on people, most of whom had been tested repeatedly and tested negative. And thysbusvsn outdoor sport is the threshold which I still don’t understand cannot be what it is for an indoor sport prior to vaccine availability.

Logan Hart
Logan Hart
2 months ago

The ncaa should be getting sued for discrimination. The entire stadium has untested spectators but they don’t give a crap. Seriously!?

Sec is china of the ncaa and the ncaa is still corrupt.

Logan Hart
Logan Hart
2 months ago
Reply to  Logan Hart

And vandys coach made some most arrogant comments. This is the reason Noone likes the sec.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Logan Hart

Liar